1
00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:22,199
Stella Rimington,
a former director-general of MI5,

2
00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:26,439
in particular felt that John le Carre
had undermined the importance,

3
00:00:26,440 --> 00:00:29,479
the dignity,
as well as the good humour

4
00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:32,800
of ensuring the safety
of the British state.

5
00:00:35,440 --> 00:00:39,719
"The room was dimly lit,
the air thick with tension.

6
00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:44,119
Liz Carlyle knew she was about
to enter into something dangerous,

7
00:00:44,120 --> 00:00:45,999
but she had no choice.

8
00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:48,679
She had made a decision long ago

9
00:00:48,680 --> 00:00:52,159
to serve her country, to protect it.

10
00:00:52,160 --> 00:00:55,839
But now, as she sat across
from her superior,

11
00:00:55,840 --> 00:01:00,280
she understood that the stakes were
higher than she'd ever imagined.

12
00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:04,999
The line between right and wrong
was not always clear

13
00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:07,199
and in the world of intelligence,

14
00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:11,560
loyalty was the currency
more valuable than gold."

15
00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:19,519
But she does reject,
and I think intentionally so,

16
00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:23,959
an interpretation
of what happened in the Cold War

17
00:01:23,960 --> 00:01:25,719
and our understanding of that,

18
00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:29,119
which I think has been
heavily coloured by le Carre,

19
00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:33,839
and gives what you might see
as a more positive view

20
00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:36,840
of what was going on.

21
00:01:37,960 --> 00:01:39,919
"'A dry martini,' he said.

22
00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:43,319
'One in a deep champagne goblet.

23
00:01:43,320 --> 00:01:46,479
Three measures of Gordon's,
one of vodka,

24
00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:49,319
half a measure of Kina Lillet.

25
00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:52,479
Shake it very well
until it's ice cold.

26
00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:57,759
Then add a large, thin slice
of lemon peel. Got it?'"

27
00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:04,919
One of the great assets of
British intelligence at its best...

28
00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:07,079
Not all the time, just at its best.

29
00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:11,159
...it realised
it could make use of talents

30
00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:14,519
that other intelligence services
could not do.

31
00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:18,359
You know, the best-known British spy
is a fictional figure,

32
00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:22,639
which he obviously is,
cos James Bond is better known

33
00:02:22,640 --> 00:02:26,319
than any real spy
in British history.

34
00:02:26,320 --> 00:02:30,919
Happens to be
a global box office success.

35
00:02:30,920 --> 00:02:34,759
But no other country
has been able to produce

36
00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:36,520
such an extraordinary spy.

37
00:02:38,920 --> 00:02:42,119
'Seven, six, five...'

38
00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:45,439
Bang on time.
I admire your courage, Miss...?

39
00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:48,799
Trench. Sylvia Trench.

40
00:02:48,800 --> 00:02:52,159
I admire your luck, Mr...?

41
00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:55,720
Bond. James Bond.

42
00:02:57,040 --> 00:03:00,399
The best-known spy of all
is James Bond,

43
00:03:00,400 --> 00:03:02,639
the creation of Ian Fleming.

44
00:03:02,640 --> 00:03:07,119
The Bond books began
with Casino Royale in 1953

45
00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:09,639
and continued until 1967.

46
00:03:09,640 --> 00:03:12,079
There were 13 novels in all.

47
00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:14,479
But it is the Bond films

48
00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:18,359
that created the full
international scale of James Bond

49
00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:22,560
and his formidable expression,
"Shaken, not stirred."

50
00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:26,839
The spectacularly successful series
of Bond films

51
00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:30,599
began with Dr No in 1962

52
00:03:30,600 --> 00:03:32,999
and has not yet come to an end.

53
00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:37,839
No less than three US presidents
commented on James Bond.

54
00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:40,479
"We couldn't have won the Cold War
without you,"

55
00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:42,439
was President Clinton's comment

56
00:03:42,440 --> 00:03:46,160
when declaring Sean Connery
an honorary US citizen.

57
00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:50,279
Lyndon Johnson said,
"In two and a half years

58
00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:54,759
of working with these men,
I have yet to meet a 007."

59
00:03:54,760 --> 00:03:57,519
For a third US president,
John F Kennedy,

60
00:03:57,520 --> 00:04:01,759
Ian Fleming was declared
to be his favourite writer.

61
00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:05,999
Kennedy's endorsement
of the release of Dr No and of Bond

62
00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:07,719
and of Ian Fleming's books

63
00:04:07,720 --> 00:04:10,399
deeply troubled
the Soviet authorities.

64
00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:12,719
They regarded Ian Fleming's influence

65
00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:16,959
on Kennedy and CIA chief Allen Dulles
as threatening.

66
00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:18,800
'They're off!'

67
00:04:20,760 --> 00:04:23,640
"All the greatest men are maniacs."

68
00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:29,399
"They are possessed by a mania
which drives them forward

69
00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:31,080
towards their goal."

70
00:04:33,840 --> 00:04:36,679
"The great scientists,
the philosophers,

71
00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:40,240
the religious leaders, all maniacs."

72
00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:45,399
"What else but a blind singleness
of purpose

73
00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:47,960
could have given focus
to their genius?"

74
00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:54,080
"Would have kept them
in the groove of purpose?

75
00:04:56,200 --> 00:05:00,360
"Mania is as priceless as genius."

76
00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,319
Someone like
CIA Director Allen Dulles,

77
00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:10,479
perhaps surprisingly,
perhaps counter-intuitively,

78
00:05:10,480 --> 00:05:14,759
was a big fan of Ian Fleming,
was a big fan of James Bond.

79
00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:16,479
"These people like Fleming,

80
00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:18,639
maybe they can get us out
of this stalemate.

81
00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:21,999
Maybe all of this crazy stuff
that we read about in Bond novels,

82
00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:24,799
or we see on our screens
in James Bond films,

83
00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:26,599
maybe there's something to that.

84
00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:28,879
Intelligence is nothing, really,

85
00:05:28,880 --> 00:05:32,080
other than information
and knowledge.

86
00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:38,519
"It's not just a question
of blowing up a building,

87
00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:40,559
or shooting a prime minister.

88
00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:44,599
Such bourgeois horseplay
is not contemplated.

89
00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:47,599
Our operation
must be delicate, refined

90
00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:51,679
and aimed at the heart of
the intelligence apparat of the West.

91
00:05:51,680 --> 00:05:55,119
It must do grave damage
to the enemy apparat,

92
00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:59,519
hidden damage, which the public
will hear perhaps nothing of,

93
00:05:59,520 --> 00:06:02,719
but which will be the secret talk
of government circles.

94
00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:07,519
But it must also cause
a public scandal so devastating

95
00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:09,559
that the world will lick its lips

96
00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:12,999
and sneer at the shame
and stupidity of our enemies.

97
00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:18,519
Naturally, governments will know
that it is a Soviet "conspiratatsia".

98
00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:22,639
That is good.
It will be a piece of hard policy

99
00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:26,439
and the agents and spies of the West
will know it too.

100
00:06:26,440 --> 00:06:31,000
And they will marvel at our
cleverness and they will tremble."

101
00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:38,879
To capture some of the essence

102
00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:43,439
of Ian Fleming's unapologetically
smart and upper-class world,

103
00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:45,359
a description would be needed

104
00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:50,199
of so many powerful,
intense vignettes and experiences.

105
00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:52,519
A literary drawing room in London,

106
00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:57,319
created by his three times married
wife Ann in Victoria Square.

107
00:06:57,320 --> 00:07:02,479
One that looked down on Ian Fleming's
great creation of James Bond.

108
00:07:02,480 --> 00:07:05,039
Of Fleming's own
late love affair

109
00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:07,999
with Jamaican socialite
Blanche Blackwell,

110
00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:09,839
mother of Chris Blackwell,

111
00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:14,679
founder of Island Records,
the record label of Bob Marley.

112
00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:18,719
His wife Ann's extraordinary
and loving affair

113
00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:23,560
with a ballroom-dancing leader
of the Labour Party, Hugh Gaitskell.

114
00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:27,759
There's a story about Ian Fleming

115
00:07:27,760 --> 00:07:30,839
being asked about who the chap was
at the end of the table.

116
00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:33,999
And he replied,
"That's Hugh Gaitskell,

117
00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:37,199
the leader of the Labour Party
and my wife's lover."

118
00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:40,239
"'The man in the mirror
is the only one who can stop you

119
00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:42,399
from being what you are.'

120
00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:45,920
The thought flashed through his mind
with a startling clarity.

121
00:07:46,920 --> 00:07:51,920
In that instant, Bond knew that
the end was nearer than he thought."

122
00:07:58,520 --> 00:08:01,679
This world is a world
which, in Jamaica,

123
00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:04,599
included Noel Coward, Errol Flynn

124
00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:06,639
and so many other players

125
00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:10,479
in the decaying celebrity world
of the 1950s.

126
00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:13,039
It would need to include the suicide

127
00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:18,080
of his young, drug-addicted
and Egyptologist son, Casper.

128
00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:24,919
Ian Fleming's own melancholy funeral
in the small church at Sevenhampton,

129
00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:30,440
attended by just mourners
and his slightly late wife Ann.

130
00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:34,439
It would need to know
about the frowned-upon marriage

131
00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:38,039
of his admired
and glamorous brother Peter Fleming

132
00:08:38,040 --> 00:08:39,959
to Celia Johnson,

133
00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:43,959
soon-to-be the star
of Noel Coward's and David Lean's

134
00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:46,999
In Which We Serve
and Brief Encounter.

135
00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:48,759
It would also need to know

136
00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:52,759
of Ian Fleming's extraordinary
and judgmental mother Eve.

137
00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:57,479
This world of intense luxury,
private despair,

138
00:08:57,480 --> 00:09:01,359
and in Ian Fleming's case,
and in his own words,

139
00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:05,519
of a very sad man
at the heart of his life.

140
00:09:05,520 --> 00:09:10,239
All together making up
an intense and powerful world

141
00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:11,920
now long gone.

142
00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:19,119
Ian Fleming's work, however,
remains at the centre of the myths

143
00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:21,800
of our current cultural world.

144
00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:27,999
Ian Fleming's personal world
was extended by other events.

145
00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:33,079
In 1956 Prime Minister Anthony Eden
came to recuperate

146
00:09:33,080 --> 00:09:35,760
at Ian Fleming's home Goldeneye
in Jamaica...

147
00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:39,600
...after the disaster of Suez.

148
00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:45,839
Ian Fleming had a half sister.

149
00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:49,479
His mother Eve
had pretended to adopt a child,

150
00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:53,279
conceived with
the great painter Augustus John.

151
00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:56,639
Amaryllis Fleming
became a distinguished cellist,

152
00:09:56,640 --> 00:09:59,920
second only in quality
to Jacqueline du Pre.

153
00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:05,319
She appeared in the 1969 film
Connecting Rooms

154
00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:08,440
as the arms and fingers
of Bette Davis.

155
00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:15,079
Ian Fleming's only young son Caspar

156
00:10:15,080 --> 00:10:18,399
was named after Augustus John's son,

157
00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:21,560
Admiral of the Fleet,
Sir Caspar John.

158
00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:28,080
Bob Marley was eventually
to buy Goldeneye.

159
00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:32,040
He turned it into a hotel,
which it still is.

160
00:10:33,560 --> 00:10:35,879
And it's interesting,
and I think important,

161
00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:39,959
that all of his Bond novels

162
00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:44,159
were written outside England,
in a very different context.

163
00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:47,759
That isolation that Bond has

164
00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:51,119
has to do with his own sense
of dislocation,

165
00:10:51,120 --> 00:10:54,239
which persisted throughout his life.

166
00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:58,959
Well, I can say it's 90%
from personal experience, really.

167
00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:03,159
If I started sticking too close
to the espionage,

168
00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:05,799
true espionage work of today,

169
00:11:05,800 --> 00:11:09,640
I should be in trouble with
the Official Secrets Act in England.

170
00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:15,680
His life was restless,
not an easy life.

171
00:11:16,800 --> 00:11:19,999
His father died
in the First World War,

172
00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:22,719
when he was nine years old.

173
00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:26,959
It's not the same thing
as an abandonment

174
00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:29,399
of the kind that
le Carre experienced,

175
00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:32,640
but nevertheless a huge loss.

176
00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:36,439
He was a member
of the British establishment,

177
00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:38,959
but it was never straightforward.

178
00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:44,079
What made him was his experience
of the Second World War.

179
00:11:44,080 --> 00:11:48,799
He put on a uniform
and had a role in life.

180
00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:52,079
There was a great deal of sadness

181
00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:54,599
and, to some extent, disillusionment

182
00:11:54,600 --> 00:12:00,320
in his relationship
with British national identity.

183
00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:04,159
"Bond was suddenly aware

184
00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:06,600
that he was living
on the edge of an abyss.

185
00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:10,879
He had known the feeling
many times before,

186
00:12:10,880 --> 00:12:12,880
but never quite so keenly."

187
00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:19,400
"He was trying to kill a man
who was trying to kill him."

188
00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:24,319
"And in doing so,
he had to acknowledge

189
00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:27,440
the desolate world
in which he lived."

190
00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:36,360
"I found that
one must try and teach people...

191
00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:40,239
...that there's no top limit
to disaster,

192
00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:43,280
but so long as
breath remains in your body...

193
00:12:44,280 --> 00:12:47,959
...you've got to accept
the miseries of life.

194
00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:52,599
They will often seem infinite, insupportable.

195
00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:55,520
They are part
of the human condition."

196
00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:05,759
An ordinary black leather case,

197
00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:09,119
with 20 rounds of ammunition
here and here.

198
00:13:09,120 --> 00:13:14,679
There's an interesting debate
among intelligence professionals

199
00:13:14,680 --> 00:13:16,839
as to whether
someone like James Bond

200
00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:19,759
has been good or bad
for the business.

201
00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:22,079
Flat throwing knife.
Press that button there.

202
00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:25,239
Some people would argue
that Bond has been incredibly good

203
00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:27,679
for the British intelligence
community.

204
00:13:27,680 --> 00:13:30,199
But then there is other ways
to look at this.

205
00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:32,639
And some intelligence professionals
would say

206
00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:35,239
that Bond has been incredibly bad
to their profession

207
00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:37,039
because Bond gives the impression

208
00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:39,559
that this is all about
conspicuous consumption,

209
00:13:39,560 --> 00:13:43,199
jet-setting, sex, martinis,
Savile Row suits,

210
00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:46,759
and that, arguably, is not
a true reflection of the monotony

211
00:13:46,760 --> 00:13:50,440
and the humdrum that accompanies
a lot of intelligence work.

212
00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:10,080
OK.

213
00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:27,479
The gadgets seen
in James Bond books and films

214
00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:31,679
are not the idiosyncratic ideas
of an imaginative author,

215
00:14:31,680 --> 00:14:35,119
but are based on the actual
extraordinary inventions

216
00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:37,199
created during the Second World War

217
00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:40,479
by the remarkable mind
of Charles Fraser Smith,

218
00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:42,399
one-time missionary.

219
00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:46,119
Working in the clothing department
of the Ministry of Supply,

220
00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:50,120
he devised untold gadgets
during the Second World War.

221
00:14:51,600 --> 00:14:55,880
Fraser Smith is, quite simply,
the inspiration for Q.

222
00:14:58,560 --> 00:15:00,519
Maybe you've been down here
too long.

223
00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:03,040
The ultimate in British engineering.

224
00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:06,479
You must be joking.

225
00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:10,320
As I learned from my predecessor,
Bond, I never joke about my work.

226
00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:13,359
Aston Martin call it the Vanquish.

227
00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:15,480
We call it the Vanish.

228
00:15:20,840 --> 00:15:23,439
Oh, very good.
Adaptive camouflage.

229
00:15:23,440 --> 00:15:27,079
Tiny cameras on all sides
project the image they see

230
00:15:27,080 --> 00:15:30,319
onto a light emitting polymer skin
on the opposite side, you see.

231
00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:32,799
To the casual eye,
it's as good as invisible.

232
00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:36,079
Plus all the usual refinements,
ejector seat, torpedoes,

233
00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:40,199
target-seeking shotguns
to shoot down mobile objects.

234
00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:42,599
Why don't you acquaint yourself
with the manuals?

235
00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:45,120
You ought to shoot through that
in a couple of hours.

236
00:15:51,040 --> 00:15:53,000
It just took a few seconds, Q.

237
00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:56,960
I wish I could make you vanish.
Hmm.

238
00:15:59,280 --> 00:16:01,799
Fraser Smith's Q gadgets

239
00:16:01,800 --> 00:16:03,719
ranged from miniature cameras

240
00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:05,799
to hair brushes containing a map

241
00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:10,239
and steel shoelaces that could be
used for garrotting the enemy.

242
00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:14,520
After the war, he became
a successful dairy farmer.

243
00:16:20,120 --> 00:16:22,439
Magnificent, isn't she?

244
00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,999
Zero to 60 in 3.2 seconds.
Fully bulletproof.

245
00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:27,840
Few little tricks up her sleeve.

246
00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:31,319
It's a shame, really.
She was meant for you,

247
00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:33,880
but she's been reassigned to 009.

248
00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:36,800
But you can have this.

249
00:16:42,520 --> 00:16:44,239
Does it do anything?

250
00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:45,999
It tells the time.

251
00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:51,399
AI, as currently put together
by computer scientist,

252
00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:55,999
is really good
at looking at a million photographs

253
00:16:56,000 --> 00:16:57,999
and very quickly,
very, very quickly,

254
00:16:58,000 --> 00:16:59,719
a thinking fast assignment,

255
00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:02,639
very, very quickly
finding the photograph

256
00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:04,519
of a Russian bomber in the sky.

257
00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:07,679
What AI can't yet do is tell you

258
00:17:07,680 --> 00:17:10,599
where that Russian bomber
took off from,

259
00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:13,599
where it's going
and, most importantly of all,

260
00:17:13,600 --> 00:17:15,639
what on Earth is it doing
in the sky?

261
00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:18,079
That's where you still need humans
in the loop.

262
00:17:18,080 --> 00:17:23,639
Ian Fleming himself was
much less fascinated by all that

263
00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:28,799
and, really, quite wanted
to rid himself of Bond

264
00:17:28,800 --> 00:17:32,079
at the end of From Russia With Love,

265
00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:34,239
when Rosa Klebb,

266
00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:39,119
one of the more sinister women
in spy fiction,

267
00:17:39,120 --> 00:17:44,640
poisons Bond with the blade
embedded in her shoe.

268
00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:57,439
All sorts of elements
into the Bond persona

269
00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:00,559
were imported into the film,

270
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:03,039
which really don't exist
in the novels.

271
00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:08,079
It's easy to forget
how short Ian Fleming's life was.

272
00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:12,239
He died in 1964, in his 50s.

273
00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:14,639
He was a very heavy smoker.

274
00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:16,479
He drank heavily.

275
00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:18,199
He changed,

276
00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:23,119
so Bond in the context
of the decline of British power

277
00:18:23,120 --> 00:18:26,759
and certainly the decline
of British confidence,

278
00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:30,640
Bond becomes an all-conquering hero.

279
00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:34,759
James Bond in No Time to Die

280
00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:39,399
marks a remarkable moment
in cultural and social history.

281
00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:43,439
The touching scenes of Bond
as father and loving partner

282
00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:46,439
and his death mark an intense change

283
00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:49,080
in the cultural description
of his persona.

284
00:18:50,360 --> 00:18:52,799
The recent sale
of the exclusive rights

285
00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:55,719
to the depiction of Bond
on film to Amazon

286
00:18:55,720 --> 00:18:59,399
makes for an intriguing prospect of
"where now?"

287
00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:01,439
for this powerful representative.

288
00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:05,479
Perhaps not just a British,
but an international icon,

289
00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:09,039
representing how audiences
and politicians

290
00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:12,359
describe the geopolitical
and personal worlds

291
00:19:12,360 --> 00:19:14,680
of our collective lived life.

292
00:19:16,120 --> 00:19:22,399
We find Bond no longer representing
a national identity.

293
00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:26,639
He has become a family man,

294
00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:30,239
which is not at all part

295
00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:33,880
of the central Bond identity.

296
00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:36,560
Bonne nuit.

297
00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:44,520
Ferme les yeux.

298
00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:49,200
She's not yours.

299
00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:54,200
But... OK, the blue eyes?
The... Just...

300
00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:56,840
She's not yours.

301
00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:01,559
OK.
He has a five-year-old daughter.

302
00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:04,439
He has a relationship,
a loving relationship,

303
00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:06,199
with Madeleine Swann.

304
00:20:06,200 --> 00:20:08,799
And his death on screen

305
00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:13,199
is not to protect
any kind of national interest,

306
00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:15,959
though, as ever,
he is fighting evil,

307
00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:19,479
it is to protect his daughter

308
00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:22,160
and to protect Madeleine Swann.

309
00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:25,240
You have made...

310
00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:31,840
...the most... beautiful thing
I've ever seen.

311
00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:35,360
She's perfect...

312
00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:40,840
...because she came from you.

313
00:20:46,360 --> 00:20:48,040
I love you.

314
00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:52,799
I love you too.

315
00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:15,360
She does have your eyes.

316
00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:20,600
I know.

317
00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:35,880
I know.

318
00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:51,279
In the lives of Ian Fleming
and John le Carre,

319
00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:55,160
there exist hauntings
of the ghosts of fathers.

320
00:21:56,800 --> 00:21:58,759
Ian Fleming's father

321
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:02,480
always existed as a perfect exemplar
to live up to...

322
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:06,720
...and miss so much.

323
00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:15,959
John le Carre raises the question

324
00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:18,720
of whether it is possible
to trust your father.

325
00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:23,640
The father seems to always betray.

326
00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:28,239
This is also the threat
that all spies face

327
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:30,160
in their professional lives.

328
00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:34,599
The State, our collective father,

329
00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:36,600
also cannot be trusted.

330
00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:43,160
It cannot support spies
in their hours of greatest need...

331
00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:47,639
...and may even,
through state violence

332
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:50,840
and the actions of state traitors,
kill you.

333
00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:55,679
The argument made by the State

334
00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:59,879
is that intelligence
and espionage are essential,

335
00:22:59,880 --> 00:23:01,839
whatever the human cost,

336
00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:04,880
to protect the state
and its population.

337
00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:08,199
It is impossible in all this

338
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:11,679
not to hear the words
of Jesus Christ on the cross

339
00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:14,919
during his crucifixion
by the Roman State,

340
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:18,279
asking his own father,
the living God,

341
00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:21,520
"Father, why hast thou forsaken me?"

342
00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:29,719
The coincidence of the personal
and professional

343
00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:34,280
is vivid in the lives
of Ian Fleming and John le Carre.

344
00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:41,559
To this can also be added
Winston Churchill,

345
00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:45,799
who, even after his great
achievements of the Second World War,

346
00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:50,759
was to ask if his much loved
but neglectful father

347
00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:52,880
would be proud of him now.

348
00:23:57,680 --> 00:23:59,639
In Triumph And Tragedy,

349
00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:02,919
the final volume of his history
of the Second World War,

350
00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:04,639
Churchill wrote,

351
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:09,320
"I have achieved so much
to have achieved nothing in the end."

352
00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:16,839
Perhaps thereby prefiguring
the same disappointments

353
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:20,560
as those felt
by Ian Fleming and John le Carre.

354
00:24:22,360 --> 00:24:27,159
You could say that the State
is the father figure

355
00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:32,639
and that David's ambivalent attitude
towards his employers,

356
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:36,519
that's towards the State,
towards Britain,

357
00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:38,279
towards the establishment,

358
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,599
reflects his ambivalent feelings
about his father.

359
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:46,239
He knew his father was a monster
who ruined people's lives,

360
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:48,279
who was a man without any principle,

361
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:50,719
but he was also
the only parent in his life,

362
00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:53,640
the only parent figure
that he loved.

363
00:24:55,120 --> 00:25:00,439
Self-examination is an activity
rarely undertaken by States

364
00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:05,240
and their inhabitants, particularly,
it may be said, in Britain.

365
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:10,599
How remarkable it is that in Britain,

366
00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:12,799
in the writings of Graham Greene,

367
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:14,839
Ian Fleming and John le Carre,

368
00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:17,479
intelligence and spying

369
00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:21,280
contain personal
and national self-examination.

370
00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:28,759
In the case of le Carre,

371
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:32,760
the outcome becomes
increasingly bleak and bitter.

372
00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:39,199
Recently, the Guardian newspaper
has suggested

373
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:42,920
that the increasing interest
in spy fiction and films...

374
00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:48,480
...is because of the distrust of
the State by the general population.

375
00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:54,879
I feel actually he's, to some
extent, still in the room with me.

376
00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:56,999
I still feel his hand
on my shoulder

377
00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:01,960
and I would be happy
to see him again.

378
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:06,640
Not that I ever will.

379
00:26:09,520 --> 00:26:13,879
The most visually attractive
KGB dead letterbox

380
00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:15,599
in the whole of London

381
00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:19,879
was in the main Catholic Church,
in Brompton Oratory.

382
00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:25,279
At the main entrance,
the instructions say,

383
00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:29,279
"Look for the side altar,"

384
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:33,919
which contains a reproduction
of Michelangelo's Pieta.

385
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:36,959
This is the dead Christ
in his mother's arms.

386
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:40,680
The original
is in St Peter's in Rome.

387
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:45,120
Look immediately below the statue...

388
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:48,239
...for the last words from the cross,

389
00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:51,359
in Latin, "Consummatum est,"
"It is finished."

390
00:26:51,360 --> 00:26:56,959
Then move along to the left
of, "Consummatum est"

391
00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:00,679
and there are two pillars
set into the wall.

392
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:04,279
Go to the second one
and at the level of the inscription,

393
00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:06,359
put your hand behind it.

394
00:27:06,360 --> 00:27:10,680
And there is the dead letterbox.

395
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:15,239
For intelligence organisations,

396
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,439
the nature of threats to the State

397
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:21,360
and changes in internal
and external terrorism...

398
00:27:22,360 --> 00:27:25,280
...have presented new risks
and new solutions.

399
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,119
"Security comes at a price.

400
00:27:29,120 --> 00:27:33,639
The threat of terrorism imposes
restrictions on individual liberty,

401
00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:37,719
as the gates to Downing Street
mutely remind us.

402
00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:41,599
And there is a price
in terms of personal privacy

403
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:46,119
to allow the authorities to generate
the pre-emptive intelligence

404
00:27:46,120 --> 00:27:50,920
on which much of the effort
to maintain public security rests.

405
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,799
The price buys the security

406
00:27:54,800 --> 00:27:59,360
under whose wings the benefit
of good government can be reaped."

407
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:05,119
I think the difficulty
that intelligence agencies face

408
00:28:05,120 --> 00:28:08,879
is that they cannot really
communicate on their success, right?

409
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:12,759
They cannot say, "This is exactly
the kind of terrorist attacks

410
00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:14,639
that we manage to prevent."

411
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:20,079
This is where this sort of
pervasive conspiratorial mindset,

412
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:23,359
which is ingrained in the public,
kicks in.

413
00:28:23,360 --> 00:28:27,359
The last two decades
were mostly about counterterrorism.

414
00:28:27,360 --> 00:28:29,079
We've entered a new phase

415
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:32,119
since the Russia's full scale
invasion of Ukraine.

416
00:28:32,120 --> 00:28:33,839
And what we mean by that

417
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:36,119
is usually the return
of great power rivalry,

418
00:28:36,120 --> 00:28:37,999
even though it's always been there.

419
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:41,319
Not to say that counterterrorism
has completely disappeared,

420
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:43,559
but, of course,
a whole set of resources

421
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:47,440
is being relocated to different
kinds of threats as we speak.

422
00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:51,359
The reasons for
joining intelligence services,

423
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:53,839
particularly
British intelligence services,

424
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:57,439
have changed enormously
over the last generation.

425
00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:02,599
Anyone who wishes to become
a member of either MI5 or MI6

426
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:05,479
or other branches
of the intelligence setting,

427
00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:08,839
all they've got to do is log in.

428
00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:13,560
But in the old days,
it was a tap on the shoulder.

429
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:18,159
The question was never, "Would you
be interested in becoming a spy?"

430
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,719
If you applied
to the Foreign Office,

431
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:24,079
you might get
a supplementary communication

432
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:27,319
which said, "Would you be interested

433
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:31,639
in certain other jobs
which may become available?"

434
00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:34,399
I'm sure you're both wondering
what all this is about.

435
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:36,759
Did you get any clues
at our previous interviews?

436
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:38,479
No.
Well, I made a guess.

437
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:40,439
Seems to have been wrong.
What was it?

438
00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:42,159
Some sort of Commando work,

439
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:44,519
but, obviously,
if Ms Williams is involved...

440
00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:46,959
As a matter of fact,
your guess wasn't so far out.

441
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:49,519
Commando work isn't a bad way
of describing it.

442
00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:51,639
I want you both to go
to occupied France.

443
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,559
France.
How?

444
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:56,799
By sea or air.
Only, you won't be going in uniform.

445
00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:58,559
What do we do when we get there?

446
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:01,799
Organised resistance,
act as liaison officers with London.

447
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:04,319
Would we be working together?
I hope so.

448
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,839
Ms Williams would be
your wireless operator.

449
00:30:06,840 --> 00:30:09,479
I don't need to say
the job is difficult and dangerous.

450
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:11,519
That must be obvious to you both.

451
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:13,879
Are there any questions
before you decide?

452
00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:16,999
What made you pick on us?
It wasn't just haphazard.

453
00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:19,959
We make extensive inquiries
before we recruit our people.

454
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:22,199
Do you think we're the right people
for the job?

455
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:24,280
We're sure of it.
All right. I'm on.

456
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:26,999
Over the past couple of years,

457
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:29,679
especially since
the Russian invasion of Ukraine,

458
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:31,439
we've seen quite a lot of changes

459
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:36,199
in how States and their intelligence
agencies recruit agents abroad

460
00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:39,159
and we've seen this especially
when it comes to Russia.

461
00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:43,399
We've seen that Russia now hires
various agents online

462
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:47,039
and uses them to carry out
various covert operations,

463
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:50,839
such as assassinations
or sabotage operations,

464
00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:53,319
attacking critical infrastructure

465
00:30:53,320 --> 00:30:57,439
that is used to deliver
various supplies to Ukraine.

466
00:30:57,440 --> 00:30:59,759
We sometimes get access
into their phones

467
00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:02,479
and we see thousands
or tens of thousands,

468
00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:05,399
in some cases hundreds of thousands,
text messages

469
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:09,239
that they have exchanged
with their Russian handlers.

470
00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:12,839
The Russians have told
a number of youths in the UK,

471
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:16,199
who were meant to carry out
an arson attack in East London,

472
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:18,799
to watch the TV show The Americans.

473
00:31:18,800 --> 00:31:21,799
They tell us what to do
and we do it.

474
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:24,040
That's how it works.

475
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,199
There is, since the war in Ukraine,

476
00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:30,399
a significant increase
in various covert operations

477
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:34,119
and we are now witnessing
the most intense wave of sabotage

478
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:35,919
since World War Two.

479
00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:38,879
And we've seen this in the UK.
We've seen this in Germany.

480
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:41,079
We've seen this
in the Czech Republic, Poland

481
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:43,399
and a number
of other frontier states.

482
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:47,640
There's clearly been attempts
to also blow up cargo planes.

483
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:56,679
After the wartime success of Ultra

484
00:31:56,680 --> 00:32:00,159
and the breaking of the Enigma code
at Bletchley Park,

485
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:03,839
the history of allied post-war
intelligence events

486
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,479
includes intelligence-led actions

487
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:09,319
in Kenya, Malaya, Korea,

488
00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:13,239
Operation Gold, Operation Ajax,

489
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:16,359
intervention in the Iran
and the Congo,

490
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:20,279
Guatemala, the Bay of Pigs, Vietnam,

491
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:23,079
Operation Cyclone in Afghanistan,

492
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:27,479
missiles in Cuba,
Gary Powers and the U-2 incident,

493
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,200
Aldrich Ames and Edward Snowden.

494
00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:35,319
Grudgingly, I may be sympathetic

495
00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:39,159
to some of Snowden's revelations
about, you know, mass surveillance,

496
00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:41,879
invasions into our privacy, grudgingly.

497
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,279
I'm absolutely not sympathetic

498
00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:46,239
to the stuff he put
in the public domain

499
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:48,679
that was tipping off our enemies.

500
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:51,359
The post-colonial
intelligence services

501
00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:54,399
of countries that had been
within the British Empire

502
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:59,279
retained close connections with
MI6 in Britain after independence.

503
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:03,159
More disturbingly,
in the sometimes hasty withdrawal

504
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:06,679
and, in the case of India,
the scuttle from colonial rule.

505
00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:09,079
British colonial
intelligence services

506
00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:13,719
instituted and administered
harsh and repressive policies

507
00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:16,119
in Kenya, Malaya and Cyprus,

508
00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:18,719
showing a cruel and vindictive edge

509
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:24,439
to the late Imperial use of British
and colonial intelligence capability.

510
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:27,239
Calder Walton goes on to argue,

511
00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:31,199
after accessing
the recently declassified records,

512
00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:34,039
that despite the Cold War
being emphasised

513
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:36,319
in history, fiction and films,

514
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:38,639
that it's Middle Eastern terrorism,

515
00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:41,839
with what he says is
chilling contemporary relevance,

516
00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:46,199
that was a far bigger threat
to Britain and the British Empire.

517
00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:49,919
The colonial office in London
was nearly spectacularly blown up

518
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:53,759
in 1946 by a female Stern Gang agent.

519
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:57,999
Later, the Irgun blew up
the King David Hotel in Jerusalem,

520
00:33:58,000 --> 00:33:59,839
killing 91 people.

521
00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:02,479
The Irgun were led by Menachem Begin,

522
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:05,399
who was later to become
the Prime Minister of Israel

523
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:07,879
and joint winner
of the Nobel Peace Prize.

524
00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:10,559
'After a bomb explosion
caused by terrorists

525
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:12,599
on the British headquarters
of Jerusalem,

526
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:14,879
one entire corner
of the King David Hotel,

527
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:17,799
a building of seven stories,
was razed to the ground.

528
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:19,839
The stone floors
were cut clean away,

529
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:23,199
as if they'd been hit
by a 1,000-pound bomb from above.

530
00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:24,919
Housed in the destroyed wing

531
00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:27,239
were the greater part
of the government office,

532
00:34:27,240 --> 00:34:30,039
where work was in full swing
at the time of the outrage.'

533
00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:35,359
The British response in Kenya,
Palestine, Malaya, Aden and Cyprus

534
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:38,759
often included rendition and torture.

535
00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:43,119
Withdrawal from Empire
was partially overseen by MI5,

536
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,719
throughout
the British colonial withdrawal.

537
00:34:45,720 --> 00:34:50,680
MI5 was closely involved
in assessing risks and outcomes.

538
00:34:51,720 --> 00:34:56,239
The official narrative of a peaceful
change from Empire to Commonwealth

539
00:34:56,240 --> 00:34:59,879
is challenged by the evidence
being revealed by the documents

540
00:34:59,880 --> 00:35:02,359
slowly being released from MI5

541
00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:05,040
and the Joint Intelligence Committee
files.

542
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:09,359
As there remain many documents
still to be declassified,

543
00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:11,879
there are likely to be
further revelations

544
00:35:11,880 --> 00:35:14,360
that are unlikely to be welcomed.

545
00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:22,999
At the same time as colonial powers
were withdrawing from Africa,

546
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:27,799
Russia, through the KGB, was becoming
increasingly influential.

547
00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:30,319
Though after the fall
of the Soviet Union,

548
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:32,679
much of this influence was lost.

549
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:36,599
It is now China
that has both soft and hard power

550
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:40,960
through its One Belt One Road
economic development strategy.

551
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:44,999
The British government
changed policy about secrecy

552
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:47,799
when it became clear
that conspiracy theories

553
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:51,439
about intelligence were sounding
less conspiratorial

554
00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:53,919
than the government
would like them to be.

555
00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:56,599
Historians
like Christopher Andrew and others

556
00:35:56,600 --> 00:36:00,559
were allowed access to documents
previously kept secret.

557
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:05,599
One of the reasons why intelligence
services and intelligence agencies

558
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:11,119
have used fiction to, you know,
communicate on their activities,

559
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:16,639
is also to establish,
not only the legitimacy of secrecy,

560
00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:20,479
but also to say that,
"This is not what we're doing,"

561
00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:23,279
but actually they're adding
another layer of secrecy

562
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:26,360
and protecting
what should remain secret.

563
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:33,599
The Middle East was always an area
of dramatic concern and intervention.

564
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:39,079
The Israeli intelligence organisation
Mossad was continuously effective.

565
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:43,479
At Entebbe, in the destruction
of Iran's nuclear reactor,

566
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:45,479
in Operation Wrath of God

567
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:51,319
and most recently with widespread
pinpoint targeting and assassination.

568
00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:53,999
Israel's Foreign Intelligence
Service, the Mossad,

569
00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:56,479
has a long history
in conducting assassinations.

570
00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:58,319
Assassinations have been a part

571
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:01,000
of their statecraft toolkit,
if you will.

572
00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:05,319
But we are seeing them
use more technology

573
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:07,199
and more sophisticated technology

574
00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:09,919
to carry these out
in a way where, perhaps,

575
00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:12,599
the officers who are carrying
these operations out

576
00:37:12,600 --> 00:37:14,319
do not have to be in the theatre.

577
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:16,959
I think the nature
of Israel's predicament

578
00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:21,039
that it's surrounded by,
it perceives as hostile states...

579
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:23,439
There are individuals
within Israel as well

580
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:25,359
that are seen to pose a threat.

581
00:37:25,360 --> 00:37:28,079
And that naturally, then, shapes
their perception

582
00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:30,480
and understanding
of intelligence work.

583
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:33,799
There was still
a steep learning curve there

584
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:36,039
when it came to al Qaeda, ISIS

585
00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:39,079
and religiously motivated,
or should I say,

586
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:41,880
politically-religiously
motivated groups.

587
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:46,119
We had a head start because,
obviously, we had to deal with

588
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:48,799
the IRA in Northern Ireland
in the '70s and '80s.

589
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:51,720
So the counter-terrorism mission
was not alien to us.

590
00:37:58,920 --> 00:38:03,799
Northern Ireland remains a largely
hidden area of British intelligence.

591
00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:07,519
Recent revelations surrounding
the double agent Stakeknife

592
00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:10,799
further confirm
that British intelligence success

593
00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:15,319
in infiltrating the IRA
may have led to the IRA's decision

594
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:20,480
to, in effect, jointly create
or even force the peace process.

595
00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:24,999
MI officers using back channels,

596
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:27,559
using the techniques
of covert diplomacy

597
00:38:27,560 --> 00:38:30,599
to lay the foundations
for the Good Friday Agreement

598
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:33,679
that Blair and Clinton
and Mo Molan put together.

599
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,039
'The great powers of the world

600
00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:38,599
should avoid putting
imperialistic pressure

601
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:43,399
on innocent and weak nations
like Iran, Egypt, Tunis, Algeria,

602
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:45,879
Morocco, Palestine and others

603
00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:49,799
and prevent the world from
catching fire and disintegrating.'

604
00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:52,079
One counter to the arguments

605
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:55,399
that spy fiction and films
are overly dramatic

606
00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:57,279
and emphasise the sensational

607
00:38:57,280 --> 00:38:59,999
would be provided
by the extraordinary events

608
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:02,039
surrounding the removal from office

609
00:39:02,040 --> 00:39:05,399
of the Prime Minister of Iran
in 1953.

610
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:07,839
The British and American governments,

611
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:11,639
through their secret services,
MI6 and the CIA,

612
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,839
organised a coup,
which lead to the overthrow

613
00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:19,399
of the democratically elected
and popular Prime Minister Mosaddegh.

614
00:39:19,400 --> 00:39:24,879
It was led by Kermit Roosevelt,
the grandson of Theodore Roosevelt.

615
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:27,279
The cause was that
the British government

616
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:31,759
had lost its majority financial
interest in the Iranian Oil Company,

617
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:34,480
through its nationalisation
by Mosaddegh.

618
00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:41,119
The problem about secrets
is they need to remain the secret,

619
00:39:41,120 --> 00:39:43,679
which is why
you can't share them with others,

620
00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:49,199
unless you're British, American,
Canadian, Australian or New Zealand

621
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:53,439
because deriving from
the Second World War,

622
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:55,839
you can't possibly fight a war

623
00:39:55,840 --> 00:40:00,360
unless you share with your allies
what you're up to.

624
00:40:02,080 --> 00:40:06,439
International big business
has made revolutions before now

625
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:08,759
to safeguard its interests.

626
00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:14,000
At one time, it made them in the name
of liberty, equality and fraternity.

627
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:17,120
Now with socialism to fight...

628
00:40:18,120 --> 00:40:22,240
...it makes them in the name
of law and order and sound finance.

629
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:25,560
Assassination.

630
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:30,159
If an assassination
is going to be good for business,

631
00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:33,960
then there will be an assassination.

632
00:40:55,720 --> 00:40:59,919
"The Cold War was never as simple
as good against evil.

633
00:40:59,920 --> 00:41:02,039
It was about men in suits,

634
00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:03,799
darkened corridors

635
00:41:03,800 --> 00:41:07,999
and decisions made
with a glance, a gesture or a word

636
00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:10,760
that could kill or save thousands.

637
00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:14,279
The truth was a commodity,

638
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:17,199
a weapon that
the right person could use,

639
00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:19,999
but no-one ever really told it.

640
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:23,000
Not in the business
of espionage, anyway."

641
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:28,239
But our sharing
extended to intelligence as well.

642
00:41:28,240 --> 00:41:33,319
But because we have
an intelligence sharing arrangement,

643
00:41:33,320 --> 00:41:36,839
often known as the Five Eyes,

644
00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:38,639
we can do so.

645
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:42,679
And being able to discuss
what you deduce

646
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:44,519
about the way the world is going,

647
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:48,639
as being of one of only five
countries that can do so,

648
00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:52,319
gives us enormous advantage
over all the others.

649
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:57,479
But the next question
must always be, what are we missing?

650
00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:01,119
So a sense of your own limitations.

651
00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:05,359
Without that, you cannot be
a good intelligence officer.

652
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:08,879
We need to acknowledge in 2026

653
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:11,799
and the deeper we go
into the 21st Century,

654
00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:15,359
arguably the biggest collectors
and producers of intelligence

655
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:18,839
are not state intelligence agencies.

656
00:42:18,840 --> 00:42:21,160
They are, in fact, corporates.

657
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:26,120
They are the Amazons, the Metas,
the Facebooks, the Googles.

658
00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:32,119
A senior and veteran
intelligence officer

659
00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:35,279
told historian Peter Hennessy
about the dark side

660
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:38,199
of intelligence,
spies and spymasters.

661
00:42:38,200 --> 00:42:41,959
Hennessy describes this in his book
The Secret State

662
00:42:41,960 --> 00:42:45,159
as combining, amongst others,
the Cold War,

663
00:42:45,160 --> 00:42:49,039
the experience of Submariners
on Polaris submarines,

664
00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:52,159
posts in Eastern Europe
during the Cold War

665
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:56,799
and clustering around the worlds
of intelligence and nuclear weapons,

666
00:42:56,800 --> 00:43:00,800
the first and last lines
of the country's defence.

667
00:43:01,920 --> 00:43:04,799
So, when you talk
to intelligence professionals

668
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:08,879
about, "What's the sort of
day-to-day reality

669
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:12,959
of working
in an intelligence agency?"

670
00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:17,199
they often talk about what they call
the burden of secrecy.

671
00:43:17,200 --> 00:43:21,599
You cannot talk about what you do
with your wife or with your husband,

672
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:24,160
when you go home,
or with your children.

673
00:43:25,840 --> 00:43:29,800
Social anthropologists
regard these as special enclaves.

674
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:34,279
These are areas
of exceptional pressure.

675
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:36,759
They were in worlds apart.

676
00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:39,360
This is the defence of the realm.

677
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:49,479
This extended after the Cold War,
into special situations.

678
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:53,039
Dealing with al Qaeda
and other terrorist groups

679
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:55,999
and dealing with countries
that do not sign up

680
00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:58,439
to the international
human rights norms

681
00:43:58,440 --> 00:44:00,560
is everyday business for us now.

682
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:03,919
These states
do not have the equivalent

683
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:06,240
of the Police
and Criminal Evidence Act.

684
00:44:07,720 --> 00:44:10,199
We are always
going to have to make judgments

685
00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:12,799
that, in retrospect,
will be contentious

686
00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:15,160
within our own courts
of jurisdiction.

687
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:22,240
Internal terrorist investigations
now face the same dark side issues.

688
00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:19,520
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